Read The Transcript Below:

We’re not overpaying. No, we’re not overpaying. We’re not overpaying anymore. The tax code’s complicated, boring, and overrated. You don’t want that, you want a pro. One thing that you should know: this is a radio show. It’s not tax advice, don’t take it that way.

 

Steven (00:50):

Hello everyone, and welcome to the next episode of the Retirement Tax Services Podcast, Financial Professionals Edition. I am your host, Stephen Jarvis CPA, and with me on the show today, I have Derek Notman, who is a financial advisor, but does a whole bunch of other things. So Derek, welcome to the show. Give us, I probably, I’m sure it takes more than 30 seconds, but just, just rattle off for us real quick, a couple of things you’re involved in.

 

Derek (01:12):

Hey, Steven. Thanks a ton for having me. I appreciate it. Sending positive vibes out to all your listeners. So yeah, I’m an advisor that ended up like getting bit by the entrepreneur bug, so I’m still inactively practicing CFP. I have my own RIA I am not taking on new clients. And then, so what I’m doing is, I mean, ultimately we can dig into this topic later, but I’ve always had this frustration around this thing we call money and wanting to make it better for people. Basically fixing money for people at scale. And so I’m doing that in a couple different ways. I’ve got my Rethink podcast with my buddy Adam. I’ve got a a training course for advisors called Connector. And then I’ve got a FinTech, which is pretty cool. We’re fixing lead generation there and that’s called Coupler. So, and then I’m also a dad, married. I love to surf. I’m a gearhead. So, I don’t know how I fit it all in, but, I really do. And I think we’ve got a pretty good work-life balance to boot.

 

Steven (02:12):

That’s awesome. I love that you included some of those personal things in there. Cause that’s one of the things we want to talk about is this idea. I know it’s some of you’re really passionate about, but this idea of personal brand because, so I mean, on this show, we spend a lot of time talking about taxes and a lot of times we get pretty detailed of here’s the strategies, here’s the process, here’s the execution. But when we take a step back and as we are getting ready for the show, you described your own experience with looking for a tax advisor. Would we take a step back? I mean, people work with people who they like, who they trust, they want to connect. It’s not just who can recite the most passages from the tax code.

 

Derek (02:48):

That’s so true. Which is important. I mean, we are subject matter experts. As a tax advisor like yourself, CPAs or CFPs or advisors folks, we’re subject matter experts. You better know your stuff inside and out. But at the end of the day, we’re human beings and we connect with other human beings on the human level first. I don’t connect with you, at least most people don’t, based upon how good your Roth conversion conversation is. Not that it isn’t important, but that’s not the first thing I’m gonna bring up on a date, so to speak, if I’m interviewing an advisor. So we have to figure that part out first is who are we, what do we stand for? What’s important to us? And how can we connect with these shared commonalities with other folks? And once we connect on that human human level, we set the ground for the foundation for trust. And if I’m gonna talk to you about my money, share my W2 and my business books with you as a tax person or an advisor, or go down that health conversation to get life insurance or whatever, man, I better trust you. I better like you, otherwise I’m not gonna open up.

 

Steven (04:01):

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I really like how you’re framing that because, and, I can be guilty of this at times of focusing on, okay, what are those services? What are those value adds that are important ultimately, right? Because you can be the greatest guy in the world and maybe I connect with you and then you start working with me and you don’t actually do anything for me. And it doesn’t matter how much I like you. But we gotta make sure that we’re appropriately kind of prioritizing these and recognizing that ultimately it is that trust that brings people to us. So Derek, I mean, you were able to just really confidently say, Hey, like, I mean, what’s important to me is, is fixing this thing called money. But I would imagine that it was a journey to get to that point where you said, okay, this, this is what I’m all about. So for people listening to the show, maybe, share some of your experience of getting to that point where you can succinctly say that. I mean, what were some of the things you struggled with along the way? Figuring out what your, what was important to you personally?

 

Derek (04:53):

Yeah. It’s been a long interesting journey. You know, like a lot of advisors, I started off an agent at an insurance broker dealer. Got my series six, eventually got the seven and became, you know, an IAR and did all that stuff, but always helped work with clients and learned a lot about myself in that process and what people, I ended up being a pretty high producer there. I was really good at what I did. And it was reflecting on that it was because I got to know people. It wasn’t because I had the best product on the shelf or represented the best company. It was that we built these relationships and, you know, at its core, this whole thing we call money, it’s really kind of mind boggling if you think about it.

 

(05:40):

This is a tool. We can argue that money’s a tool. I think, at least for this conversation, that’s what we’re gonna define it as. And it’s one that virtually every person on the planet has access to in some shape or form. Whether it’s bartering with goats, or crypto or dollars or rans or euros, you know, the name, the list goes on. We all have access to this thing called money from a very early age, actually. I mean, I remember getting my first passbook savings account as a young kid. But there’s no formal education around money and that’s kind of messed up. And so what happens when we have, when money’s broken? Well, we have stress in our lives. Literally, our health is affected by it. There’s, I don’t know where the stat is, but I’ve heard that most divorces happen because of financial difficulties.

 

(06:38):

We have this thing called poverty that’s a pretty big deal. And there’s so many other little ones that come from this. So if we have all these issues with money, now we aren’t making good decisions, or maybe we stick head in the sand and don’t make a decision at all. Like, I’m sure you’ve got some tax stories. I knew a guy once who just didn’t file his taxes for 10 years. Cause he didn’t wanna deal with it.

You know, just so you get yourself into these holes because you’re not having a good relationship with money. So, for me, seeing my clients, and I apologize, this is a long-winded answer story for you here, but I noticed something around my clients that were successful and happy in the ones that weren’t, the ones that were successful and happy were the ones that made time for the money, that had a good relationship with their money, that understood it, that made educated decisions because they learned how to use this tool.

 

(07:29):

Where the ones that didn’t, the ones that were stressed out and never could just get there to start that IRA or, do that insurance. They were stressed. They didn’t understand it at its fundamental levels and didn’t want to deal with it. And so they would just compound those issues even to the point where they would make these instant gratification purchases. You know, lemme go buy that boat or that car or that watch just so I can feel better for a couple days, even though it’s really stupid financially. So anyways, long story short, that’s the journey I went on with a lot of clients in the process and ended up saying like, man, there’s gotta be a better way we can fix money. And I want to help people do that at scale. That’s the entrepreneur part. And those dimensions, those things I’m working on earlier, those are the ways that I’m executing that strategy.

 

Steven (08:17):

Well, Derek, I always love it when I bring people on the show who just reinforce for me that I’m making good decisions in life. Because obviously my thing is specific around taxes, but you’re putting such a good framework to things I hadn’t really thought through that way, but reinforce why we approach things the way we do with advisors and taxes. Things like taxes need to be a year round conversation, not a once a year conversation that there needs to be edu there needs to be education around it. There needs to be, we need to give people a frame of reference, not just say, Hey, go convert everything to Roth. Just cause right there, there needs to be this, this education, there needs to be this specific application to those individuals. Taxes is a perfect example of something that nobody ever gets education on, right? I mean, we’re all expected to pay taxes, but no one explains how it works.

 

Derek (09:02):

Again, it’s this whole money thing. Exactly. We all pay it, but we don’t even know why or how it works. That’s crazy. It’s crazy.

 

Steven (09:10):

Yeah. We never had that class in school. I mean, literally, I worked with another advisor, P.J. DiNuzzo, to write a book called “Don’t Get Killed on Taxes”. That really from our perspective, this is here, here’s something you were never taught about but have to deal with. Let’s give you an intro guide.

 

Derek (09:25):

I love it. And that Super Valley Beha link to that for folks. Cuz it is important and maybe you’re one of those advisors that doesn’t want to talk about it cuz you just don’t care. Or maybe you care, but you just don’t want to know about it cuz it’s boring for you. Find somebody that helps you do it so your clients are better off. Or if you’re a client listening to this, you probably tried your taxes. I get it.  Find someone you trust and like, and then have them do it for you.

 

Steven (09:50):

Yeah. Unfortunately, ignoring taxes and not make them go away. I mean, you joke, well, not jokingly. You, laughed as you gave the example of the client who just ignored their taxes for 10 years. That’s not a strategy we recommend. I’m sure Derek, you would also acknowledge that if he hasn’t already started getting nasty grams from the IRS that include, we might send you to jail. He will soon. Oh yeah. That’s inevitable.

 

Derek (10:10):

He had an IRS agent show up to his house.

Yeah. So you don’t want to go down that road. It’s just not worth it for so many reasons. So yeah, putting your head in the sand doesn’t work. But I understand why people do it because they never got the formal education. There’s a lack of trust. So it’s easier to stick your head in the sand because the pain of dealing with it when you don’t know what you’re dealing with is too much sometimes. And then there’s all these other stressors that come from it and then you’re dealing with those stressors and it’s not a good situation, hence is why we’re trying to fix it.

 

Steven (10:44):

Yeah. It’s a great thing to try and fix. Yeah. There’s so many great great takeaways in there. Especially around if you’re getting your clients to take action. Even on some of the things we talk about in this podcast, we, again, we focus on processes, on value add some of those things. But the underlying element that needs to be there is some level of understanding from the client. So there’s a level of commitment. They don’t need to necessarily become experts, but they also can’t be completely ignorant. Or to your point earlier, they’re never gonna follow through. They’re never actually going to fund that IRA if they don’t have that base level understanding to have the commitment that goes along with it.

 

Derek (11:18):

And not only from a granular “what are the ingredients, how’s it made” perspective, but also “help me understand how that Roth IRA is gonna help me 30 years” from now because Yes, I don’t think that far in advance. Or if I do, it’s super general and broad and you know, I’m partly joking to myself. I hope I make it that long. You know, so as an advisor help connect those dots, help them visualize what does this do? It’s an IRA, it’s kind of boring. You’re in this stuff, but here’s what it actually does for you 20 from now.

 

Steven (11:54):

Yeah.

 

Derek (11:54):

And I think that’s a, a bounce between that and then the, the, the mechanics of it, the tax benefits and blah blah blah, blah, blah. Putting all that together. Now you’ve made it real without boring the hell outta me with a 40 page report, you know.

 

Steven (12:07):

Yeah. I appreciate you throwing that one in there. The, the 40 page reports aren’t doing many people any good. No, and Derek, this, this might sound a little bit cliche, but for, for me, it makes me think of those moments when I’m talking to the clients where you see the light go on in their eyes that you get them to that point where maybe you’re talking about a strategy you’ve talked about a hundred other times, but for that client, when you see the light go on of now, now they’re committed, now they get to your point, how this is gonna benefit them for years to come. That this isn’t about can we hide something from Uncle Sam on the tax side because this isn’t about hiding. This is about intentionally doing things when we understand what the long-term benefits are and that’s when the light goes on.

Derek (12:45):

Yeah. And when that light goes on and you’re part of that solution, you have a client for life that’s gonna refer the heck out of you. Cuz you’ve, I I’ve had clients literally break down into tiers of joy when they finally connect those dots. You know, it’s easy for us. We look at it, you know, a hundred times a day, like as advisors, tax professionals, whatever, we get this stuff and we can see the benefits very quickly. But others, you know, they’re worried about what they’re gonna put on the, you know, table for dinner tonight. You know, kids, sports, all these other things that are going on in their life. So you have to ask them to come out of that for a little while, while we talk to them and show them those benefits. And when they have that aha moment, priceless.

 

Commercial (13:27):

If a client walked through your door right now and ask to see their 10 year tax plan, what would you do? How would you answer that question? What would you show them? What actions have you taken as a financial advisor to ensure you’re delivering massive tax value to every single one of your financial planning clients without being a cpa? If you are like the hundreds of financial advisors that reach out to us from across the country, you know, you need to do a better job for your clients when it comes to tax planning. And that is why leading financial advisors across the country will be going to Las Vegas, Nevada, September 27th through the 29th to learn directly from retirement tax services, how they can improve their tax planning for financial planning. Clients go to retirement tax services.com and register to attend this incredible tax planning session September 27th through the 29th in Las Vegas, Nevada.

 

Steven (14:21):

Well the other thing I’ve noticed that, I mean, kind of goes to some of the kind of psychological things that you’re talking about as far as money being broken, is that for the people who put their head in the sand or just less engaged with these topics, including taxes, they automatically go to very dark places when they do make assumptions about what might happen. That if, when they get that letter from the IRS, it’s, I’m going to jail. When their tax advisor says, Hey, we need to talk about how much you owe this year, they assume it’s a hundred thousand dollars and they’re gonna have to sell their house. Like if, if you’re are not informed and educated, it’s really easy to go to very dark places to get, to have even more stress and pain in the process then really is necessary. But being willing to lean into that education is a critical piece to overcoming that.

 

Derek (15:04):

No question about it. Educate to empower, that’s exactly what you have to do. And financial a advisors have an amazing role there that can do so much good. So much good. And unfortunately we’re not trusted as much as we should be. You know, we need, and that’s one of the things we’re trying to fix. That’s what I do with my work at Connector and if we fix that and then people will understand, they’ll be educated, they’ll make better decisions and just good thing after a good thing happened. So we’re on the same page. We just gotta keep shouting it from the mountaintops.

Steven (15:40):

That’srRight. So let’s, let’s rewind the conversation a little bit and talk a little bit more about this idea of personal brand. And I think what would be really helpful is speak to the kinda this balance of, I mean you mentioned that you’re married, you’ve got kids, you surf, but, you can’t on your RIA side of things, you can’t just talk about, Hey, I’m a surfer and expect people to come to you for financial advice if you never bring up the financial advice side. So what’s that balance for advisors of, I wanna lead with my expertise, but I I want it also to be personal.

Derek (16:11):

It is, it’s exactly balance. You have to do both because people do connect with us on a human level, but they’re also looking for an expert to help them. So show both on the expertise side, don’t talk about how amazing this product is or that -outcomes. Outcomes in human terms. I help people retire at age 55 in a tax efficient manner. Oh, okay. That that sounds cool. I help people pay for their kids college, et cetera, et cetera. So, you can articulate cuz they’re not looking up the technical aspects of Roth conversion for 5 29 plans. Yeah. They’re wondering how do I retire? So answering the question through your content is a good way to, to help them. That content could be social blogs, video, I mean the list goes on, but on the personal side, who are you?

(17:05):

Are you a dad? Are you a mom? Do you have kids? What do you like to do outside of work? That’s my favorite question to ask at a cocktail party networking event. What do you like to do when you’re not working? And just let ’em go. So tell people that story. Share pictures, share moments, share passions. Because then they’re gonna be like, wow, that advisor, they’re, pretty cool man. They surf, they’re a dad, they like to, you know, whatever. But, but they also have their CFP and they help people retire early. Boy, that sounds like someone I’d like to get to know a little bit better. You know, tee it up for people, open the door so they can walk in when they’re ready and feel like they already know you.

 

Steven (17:48):

I would imagine would echo this as well, but building that personal brand is not something that happens overnight. This is something that you’ve gotta be consistent with, that you’ve gotta be committed to. And whether that’s, and keeping that balance in mind of the, the personal and the expertise side of, and again, whatever medium you’re using, know that this will take time to build.

Derek (18:08):

It does, it takes time. But it’s, I would say it’s not hard, but it’s also not easy. It is simple. And the, the biggest thing for me, when I started in, in the advisor space, I got the suit and tie the flash you watched, the car because that’s what I thought we were supposed to look like and sound like and do , but I felt like a fake. So just be you. Everyone else is taken. I forgot who originally did that quote. That’s a great quote. Just be you and let that come through in everything you do. And when you’re in your genuine self people, people know, people trust that. And you can build your entire brand around that, which is really awesome. So personal branding, if there’s any advisor just getting started or you’re in college and you’re thinking about being an advisor, start personal branding yesterday and get on it. Cuz it does take time to build it up, to build that following. It’s not, you know, insta-famous type of stuff, but just be you and then start talking about what you’re passionate about, how you help people, what you like to do. Don’t share what you have for breakfast though, please.

(19:15):

People don’t care.

Steven (19:18):

That is always a fun line to, to see where everyone else draws that. I mean, I’ve arbitrarily decided how much of my time I spend on what, what I look at as the content I’m trying to help build other people around versus my personal stuff. And it admittedly is arbitrary, but I try to kind of take a step back and evaluate it from time to time. But it does not include what I had for breakfast. So..

Derek (19:36):

Very good.

Steven (19:38):

Glad I’m winning on that at least. Although people probably don’t wanna hear about my races anymore either, but hey, that’s important to me, so I’m gonna keep going.

Derek (19:44):

No. Very important to you. And you could build an entire business model just out of that personal branding and all the learnings and the triumphs and the setbacks that you’ve had as a, as a racer and look at all the metals right behind you. You know, so like there’s a story there that will resonate with a certain type of person and you could build an entire business around that that

Steven (20:04):

That’ll have to be the next business. We’ll keep working with financial advisors on tax

Derek (20:07):

Plan.

Steven (20:07):

Free time, right? Yeah. And all my free time. Especially this time of year.

Derek (20:10):

Especially this time of year. Yeah.

Steven (20:12):

So Derek, I’m not an advisor so I know I’m not the target audience for connectors. So I know you’re involved in it. I know high level what it is you do. But I mean, how are you helping advisors through that platform?

Derek (20:22):

Connector is the training and guidance I wish I had had when I started. It is turn key how to build a thriving, successful practice in the digital world we live in. It’s the most legit in-depth training you’ll find anywhere. That’s not my words. That’s, that’s from people that have taken it step by step it shows you exactly how to actually build your practice. It’s not surface level nonsense that you pay too much for. It is as in depth as you could ask for to build your business. And we’re, we’re doing it in a way that that feels good. Like I was just talking to my advisor yesterday who uses it and he finds himself at the end of each module saying, cheers Derek, thanks, I’ll talk to you later. You know, so we’re really building this community and this way of thinking that just feels good and helps people be successful at the same time.

(21:11):

So we’ve been featured all over the place. It’s a really well known program. So go check it out. It’ll sell itself. You don’t need me to sell it for you, but it’s, it’s something I created for myself. Actually. I went virtual 10 years ago and say, learn all this stuff and how to build a 21st century practice. A lot of advisors ask like, how you doing all that stuff? Turned it into a business. So it’s just, it’s something I still do today. So I just, and I launched it right before Covid. Go figure. I just got lucky with that one.

Steven (21:40):

So your crystal ball doesn’t work any better than mine then.

Derek (21:43):

Not at all, man. It’s been broken. I keep trying to return it. They won’t even take it back.

Steven (21:48):

Won’t even take it back. Yeah. I mean, love the work that you’re doing through there. I know that you recently highlighted retirement tax services inside of there, which really appreciate taxes. Definitely

Derek (21:56):

Definitely buddy.

 

Steven (21:57):

Definitely plays a role in, well, what I tell advisors is, Hey, go ahead and show me the tax, the financial planning you do that doesn’t have a tax impact. I’d love to hear about it.

 

Derek (22:06):

Oh man. That’s good. Because I don’t think it’s possible.

 

Steven (22:09):

Nobody’s given me an example yet. Some people have tried. They there’s some creative people out there, but so far I don’t have any examples. So I would love to hear examples of financial planning that’s getting done that does not have a tax impact. And to be clear, that’s not financial planning you’re doing where you’re ignoring the tax impacts. Plenty of that goes on.

 

Derek (22:28):

Yeah, that doesn’t count.

(22:31):

Oh, that’s funny.

Steven (22:33):

Derek, you spent a lot of time working with advisors working on this really big idea of how do we fix money? I mean, what, andbyou’ve created a course to help people in the virtual environment. Okay, well what else do you see on the horizon as far as things that advisors should be on the lookout for that they’re inevitably gonna have to start incorporating into what they do.

Derek (22:53):

Tech’s not going away. So you have to embrace tech and get away from your yellow pad and your metal filing cabinets. Sorry guys. And I was there. I had all that stuff. But the best tech is tech that is actually gonna enhance the human connection. Cause at the end of the day, advisors most of them never wanted to be a technologist. They want to be a really great advisor. So find tech and services and partners that help you be your best advisor so you can just meet with your clients and do the planning that you need to do. So don’t ignore tech, you will be run over by it. That’s definitely something on there. Leading with advice. We are getting further and further away from product placement as a service type of thing. I could almost see, and Adam and I talked about this, I could almost see an Amazon marketplace of types of evolving where people just go buy their own insurance or whatever type of financial product they need after getting advice from an actual advisor.

 

(23:54):

So leaning into holistic planning, fiduciary, CFP, that is the future. Why is it the future? It’s what people want. The internet has given so much transparency to the work that we do, and I’m glad it has. And it’s empowered people to be more educated. We’re still trying to work on this thing we call money, but it has given them some access to information where they can start fact checking things. I had a client fact check me in real time. I’m sitting in the meeting. So it happens. So I think that’s really important that advisors lean into all of that and where’s the puck headed? I instead of where did it come from?

 

Steven (24:33):

That is a fascinating byproduct of creating so much content is when your clients start bringing up your content. Which is a lot of fun, but it definitely helps you stay sharp of Now wait, Steven this article I read that you had on us news, like how does that fit into what you’re talking about here? And thankfully we take a very holistic approach and so I haven’t ended up in a situation where I’m like, oh no. Why did you bring that up? We can talk about how it fits into their situation, but, it is a kind of a fun byproduct.

Derek (25:00):

It totally is, but necessary. Yeah. Create content. Work on your personal brand, lead with advice. That’s what people want. They’re going online. I mean, what is it? Google processes over 4 billion searches a day. That’s where people are going. So be there, be present, be genuine, and you’ll capture that market share you’re looking to capture.

 

Steven (25:24):

Absolutely. Yeah. Especially on taxes. I tell people all the time, Google has all the answers about what the tax laws are. Google can’t yet answer how that applies to Derek. And  that’s where exactly, that’s where advisors come in.

 

Derek (25:38):

You know, you bring up a really good point. So there’s all this talk about AI and what is it? Chat. GPT or whatever. I think the future is not gonna be a Skynet Terminator two situation, go watch the movie if you haven’t. But I think really what it’s gonna be is enhanced advisor intelligence with the use of technology. Yeah. That’s the sweet spot. Because technology cannot empathize with, with me as a person cannot understand nuances. It’s not ones and zeros. So the advisors that leverage tech to become a better human advisor, man, they’re gonna thrive it’s gonna be really cool to watch.

Steven (26:19):

Yeah. Super exciting. Lots of great things to come. Derek, you’ve already been giving a lot of great recommendations in there, but we always like to make sure that it’s really clear for our audience how we take information and make it valuable, which of course is taking action. As you think about what we’ve been talking about today or just your experience as an advisor in general, any other action items that come to mind for you that you would recommend that listeners take?

 

Derek (26:39):

I think what would be really important, and I did not do this early on, I found it later in my career. Take a step back from your business. Who are you, what are you truly trying to do for yourself, your family, your business, and your clients? Get clear on that. Stop worrying about the sales quotas. You may be under pressure to, you know, fulfill this month or this quarter and think of bigger picture and get your motivation, inspiration ironed out so you can really go back and be the best advisor that you can be. And a lot of people forget that when they come in like, oh, I gotta learn products, I gotta get these licenses, I gotta get these credentials, I gotta get a website. You know, blah, blah, blah. All important. But if you don’t know why you’re doing it and who you’re doing it for, what’s the point?

(27:28):

So just take a step back, take a breath of fresh air, take stock on what you’ve done. You know Napoleon Hill who did “Think and Grow Rich”? He talks about something called the Definite Chief aim. And it really helps you clarify, crystallize exactly what you were actually trying to do. So go read that book if you haven’t. It’s a brilliant book. So there, that’s, that’s what I would tell advisors to do. Probably not the technical thing that they were expecting to hear, but I can’t tell you how much benefit comes out of that and how it will drive everything from your brand to your marketing, to your sales process, to your tech stack. Everything will be a byproduct of it.

Steven (28:06):

Such a great recommendation, Derek. I mean that really fits into what we’ve been talking. We spent this podcast talking about clients and education and making sure they have that real commitment. But that, I mean, you’re just turning that around and giving that same advice to advisors if you need to figure out what that is for you. And, and I love that advice even here on a tax podcast because I know that for advisors who take that step back and whatever version of helping clients, however you define that, fixing money, whatever it is, a again, I am a hundred percent confident taxes are gonna fit in there somewhere. So I’m all for it. Take that step back, figure out what it is that you’re passionate about of how you wanna serve your clients. And if you can come up with that example of financial planning that doesn’t have a tax impact, I would still love to hear it.

Derek (28:46):

I want to hear it too. Perfect.

Steven (28:48):

I’ll make sure I loop you in. Derek, thanks so much for coming on the show today. I really appreciate your time.

Derek (28:52):

It’s a pleasure, Stephen. Thanks for having me. I hope everyone got some value out of this and if you’ve got questions, reach out to me. Best way is LinkedIn.

 

Steven (29:01):

Awesome. Well, and if you’ve listened this far through the podcast, clearly there’s some value here. So make sure that you add the Rethink Podcast to your list of podcasts that you listen to. Cause we know that podcast listeners listen to multiple and take that time to go out and leave a five star review and a comment so we can keep growing this audience. Keep growing this conversation. So until next time to all our listeners, good luck out there. And remember to tip your server, not the IRS.

 

 

We’re not overpaying. No, we’re not overpaying. We’re not overpaying anymore. The tax code’s complicated, boring, and overrated. You don’t want that, you want a pro. One thing that you should know: this is a radio show. It’s not tax advice, don’t take it that way.