Steven Jarvis, CPA (00:52)
Hello everyone, and welcome to the next episode of the Retirement Tax Services Podcast, Financial Professionals Edition. I’m your host, Steven Jarvis, CPA, and joining me this week is a great friend from LinkedIn of all places, Mando Sallavanti, a financial advisor with MassMutual who is absolutely crushing it when it comes to marketing, particularly around taxes. Mando, welcome to the show.

Mando Sallavanti (01:12)
Steven, thanks for having me, brother. Super excited to get into things today.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (01:15)
Yeah, I think this is gonna be a really great conversation. You spend a lot of time talking about taxes and we’ll get into that. I think there’s a huge area where you’re adding value to your clients. But maybe give us a little bit of background because one of the reasons I was excited to bring you on is that in my mind, you don’t fit the stereotype of a lot of advisors who talk about taxes because they’ve been around for 30 years and they’ve built this expertise and they have this long alphabet suit behind their name. I mean, you just kind of got after it and started just saying, how do I deliver value? So give us a little background and talk about how taxes look in your practice.

Mando Sallavanti (01:47)
And you know what, I think the one thing to realize about taxes for all of us is that they’re probably going to be the biggest, if not one of the biggest expenses we pay in our lifetime. And the sooner you realize that as a financial professional and you start thinking about like, where can I deliver the most value for my clients? And for me, the way that I sell financial planning, I show my fee and I show the projected range of value that we can give. And every time I was doing this, I’m like, what’s moving the needle the most? Well, it was the tax lever every time. I’m like, oh, that’s funny, that’s funny. And over and over, you start to see this. Now, sometimes that’s taxes today, more often than not, it’s future taxes. But I think all in all, with tax planning in general, you’re looking at what’s the tax bill over our lifetime and how do we minimize that, regardless of if it’s now or in the future, because that’s all we’re trying to do, minimize that number. So anyways.

(02:42)
That was like what started to peak my curiosity and originally it started with the retirement planning side of things like how do we minimize taxes in retirement and balance that with strong wealth accumulation so you’re not just getting a tax benefit to hurt yourself somewhere else. And over time, you get up market as we call it with more and more wealthier people, more and more business owners. There’s usually more opportunity for strategies on the tax front in those lanes and you realize like you have to get good at that to work with these people or else they’re not going to be a client very long because someone else who is good at it added is going to go and take them. So trial and error, learning things over and over, meeting with accountants over and over. Like, one of the best things I did, I believe my accountant is top tier guy and I pay him probably triple what I paid my old CPA. I was like, you know what? I’m going to pay this guy cause I’m going to learn so much from him and he’s probably gonna deliver value to me, which that’s another conversation we can talk about. But being in meetings with my accountant, being in meetings with client’s accountant, bouncing ideas off because one of the things, know, I’m not a CPA so I can’t give full on tax advice, but I could have great ideas that we confirm with CPAs. And that’s where I’m learning a lot of it is the hands on stuff working with other CPAs, EAs, people who might not be either of the two, but they’re accountants by trade, so it’s kind of the background, brother.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (04:06)
Yeah, well, appreciate you sharing that because again, I think it can be really easy to especially on a complicated topic like taxes. We sometimes we get in our own way and we think, hey, once I get this designation, once I’ve spent this many hours, once I’ve looked at this many tax returns, then I’ll start talking about taxes. But I love the way you’re describing it because you’re also not being irresponsible here. This isn’t, hey, you know what? I think taxes will sell. So why don’t I just pretend to know what I’m talking about and hope nobody notices? Like you took the approach of…I’m just gonna go out and confidently say taxes is an important lever. I’m gonna help make sure we find an answer. But, share from your experience what that was like at first. The first time you said, hey, I’m gonna put this in a LinkedIn post. I’m gonna put this in my marketing. I’m gonna put it in a prospect meeting. What was that confidence level right out of the gate of, was there a little bit of, I hope I can deliver on this?

Mando Sallavanti (04:52)
100 % and one of the best things I’ve done in my career is just lean on other people when I don’t feel 100 % confident or don’t know something and I’ll never like sit here in this conversation and be like I am the tax expert because I’m not, right? I’m not a CPA, not an EA and even not being those things like there’s people who aren’t those that are way better than me. But knowing when to bring in the right professional that’s been super valuable so like.

(05:19)
I’ll tell my clients, look, there’s X, Y, and Z. We have these ideas. We need this tax professional to come in and do this. Here’s roughly what it’s going to cost. What I’ve found, sometimes the value is me knowing enough about the tax strategies we’re doing or the situations that we’re in saves the client money sometimes when we have to bring the tax professional in because it’s more of a confirmation than a full on like big strategy that the tax professional has to bring up. But obviously like I can’t necessarily give the confirmation because I don’t have the credentials behind that in that sense.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (05:51)
Yeah, I like that balance of helping identify the idea and maybe even get the conversation started, maybe kind of describe that framework, but at the end of the day, you’re making sure that, whether that’s from a compliance standpoint or really it sounds like the way you think about this is making sure the client gets a great outcome, because that’s really what it should be. Like I get that compliance can be challenging at times, but at end of the day, they’re trying to protect you as the advisor, they’re trying to protect the consumer. If your focus is on how do we create the best outcome for the client, you’re usually gonna win.

(06:17)
So Mando, I wanna circle back just a little bit. You talked about that at some point in their recent memory, you switched accountants and your guess was that you pay triple now. Talk about just for that process for yourself and then we’ll apply it to clients of how did you go from, because accounting is looked at as a commodity, right? Most people wanna pay H&R block prices, but you said, great, I’ll pay triple because I see the value. Like what was that experience like for you? How did you find that person?

Mando Sallavanti (06:40)
Yeah, so this is like a collision of all the strategies I’ve used to grow my business and in literally how I hired my accountant, which I don’t think is a coincidence, by the way, because I think how we view the world and how we take action and operate comes back to us with the people interacting with our own businesses. So backtracking, my first accountant, great guy, awesome dude, just, kind of doing as a favor, he was a family friend. I think a lot of people have that account relationship at first. And that was like what it was. And my taxes started to get complex. I have a financial business, I own real estate and I do real estate investing and it’s Airbnb. So like it’s not as simple as like long-term rentals. And then I also have a consulting business. I make some money on social media partnerships. Like I’ve got a lot of things swinging to where I could tell he was getting not overwhelmed, but kind of annoyed to be honest, cause he’s like, man, like I’m my dad’s nickname is Doc. My dad’s a doctor. He’s like, man, I’m helping Doc’s kid out. Like this kid is now like the biggest pain in my butt. And he would did it for free for a year. Then he was like, I got a charge of this. And he’s like, I got a charge of this. I’m like, look, man, we should probably part ways. I can find someone. It’s okay. I don’t want to be like a pain in your butt. So while this was going on, and this is probably two years ago, Steve, and I’d been semi-active on LinkedIn. A few years back, who’s now my CPA, Yuri Kapilovitch. I met Yuri through LinkedIn and me and Yuri just like chopped it up. He lived in the city that I went to college in and like somehow he saw that on my profile and we were just talking and built a relationship. Fast forward, Yuri hosts a lot of networking events and other things and I, I’ll go to all of them because it’s in New Jersey. I’m in PA.

(08:24)
I’ll make the three hour drive, I don’t care. And he just thought that was like, he’s like, dude, like that’s just the nicest thing ever. Like most people wouldn’t do something like that. And me and him just became great friends over it. So I said to Yuri eventually, hey man, here’s my situation. I think you’re good at what you do just based on people I’ve sent to you and other things. What would it look like if you took me out as a client? Could you do that? And he did. And since then, he’s…delivered insane value to me and my old CPA, paid about five to 700 bucks on depending on the year. I pay your, mean, I hope he doesn’t mind them saying this. Pay him $2,000. I don’t think he would. I pay him $2,000 a year and I’ll gladly do that. And I know I could probably find someone, I know I could find someone cheaper, but it’s been the value. It’s been the communication and he helps me become informed, which is valuable for me as an advisor, so.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (09:14)
Well, I appreciate you sharing all that. That’s not even where I thought the conversation was gonna head today, but there’s so many good things out of that. One is for advisors to realize that, I mean, just like finding a good advisor takes this relationship building, this discovery process, it’s the same thing if you want something out of the ordinary on the CPA side. Like don’t blame your clients for having an unresponsive CPA. Like what have you done to help them go through this process to find someone who’s really gonna work with them?

(09:41)
Are you helping them understand the value proposition of not paying H&R block prices and actually expecting something more in return? I like that you shared how you came across your original CPA, because I think that’s how most you commented on. I think that’s how most people are. They kind of stumbled into whoever they work with on taxes. They know a family member that was the closest person down the street, whatever it was for most people it wasn’t some thoughtful intentional process of here’s why I work with the CPA, do. So, as an advisor, that’s a great way for you to add value specifically for clients who are having issues with executing on tax strategies because at the end of the day, only what gets reported to the IRS correctly counts for anything. Like we have to make sure it gets across the finish line.

Mando Sallavanti (10:24)
100%, 100%. And one thing I respect about him is like, he even will admit when something might even be out of his lane on the tax side. So like something very niche that happened in my own taxes, we got solar panels on our house last year and we’re taking advantage of energy credits and the solar company that I use is associated with a specific tax firm that they only specialize in solar credits and. He’s like, yeah man, let me talk to them, let me bring them in, make sure we’re doing this right. And we did and we executed it and it led to some pretty big savings, but I needed his help, I needed their help too. We brought them together, I learned more about that. And guess what, now going through that, that’s another strategy that I could bring up where it makes sense with certain clients that can qualify for some of those benefits. So just as an aside.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (11:14)
I love that you’re talking to clients about things you’ve personally been through. I think that is missing for a lot of advisors that they haven’t actually been through a lot of these things themselves, that they haven’t gone through the process of having to find a new CPA, that they haven’t seen how these strategies get executed. And some of these are worth taking the time to do, even if it’s even if it’s a very much smaller version than what your clients would do because your life situation is different. Maybe you work with clients who are significantly different age or a different career point. Take the time to mechanically go through these things so you can speak from

firsthand experience, gives you a totally different level of relationship with your clients as you work it through with them.

Mando Sallavanti (11:46))
Yeah, absolutely. And it reminds me even of myself, I paid like one of the top estate planning attorneys in my area about a year and a half ago. And I’m just like, number one, I just want to see the way this guy works. Number two, I know I’m overpaying, but whatever, because now I’m to go through a top tier process, get all the information on my own situation, I’m going to know what this is like for clients. And I’m going to be able to bring that as I coach them up of when they’re going through something like that. So whether it’s taxes, estate planning, whatever it is,

(12:15)
I think as an advisor, can not practice what you preach because there’s gonna be advice you give that is not relevant to your own situation. But if you look at the macro level, like you should know process, you should know like the way things go.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (12:27)
Absolutely one of the things I did want to ask you about because you are financial advisor with MassMutual when it comes to tax planning a lot of times you see people in the RIA space to like looking at it as kind of this this this unique is like thing that only they can do that anybody at any kind of big organization can’t even say the word tax or they’re gonna get fired. And maybe that was true 10 years ago, but I work with people at plenty of large financial organizations and I come from a large accounting background myself. So I get the appeal of working with a bigger organization, but talk a little bit about what your experiences has been leaning so heavily into tax in spite of being in what some people see as a restrictive environment.

Commercial (13:15)

Mando Sallavanti (14:57)
I think first things foremost, most advisors, they just neglect their compliance department and never communicate. Like when I wanna do something, the first email or call I make is to the right person in my compliance department, Tom, Kirsten, whoever it is, I’m like, how do I make this work? Can I make this work? And if I could, what do I need to be careful around? And what I’ll give them a ton of credit for, to my compliance department at MassMutual Greater Philadelphia, their whole thing is, it’s not about saying no, it’s about how can you do it and what do you need to be careful with. LinkedIn’s a perfect example on the other front, like how do I do it? How do I remain compliant? What do I need to be careful about? Taxes, what can I talk about? What can’t I talk about? What do I need to asterisk with? We need to talk to a CPA to confirm this, and it really is just that simple. Know your rules, stay in your lane, know when you need to bring in the other professionals.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (15:54))
Yeah, when you treat somebody else like they’re the enemy, they’re also gonna treat you like you’re an enemy. And so if your only approach to compliance is, you jerks, are you gonna tell me no on this again? Of course you’re not getting any help or support. But if you approach them proactively, you happen to know them on a first name basis, you treat them like real people, like these simple decency things, like as just a starting point, yeah, you’re gonna get much better results, which is why when I first started working with financial advisors, I just took people at their word. People in large organizations can’t do anything on taxes. Until I started meeting people like you who take the time to build these relationships and proactively approach it. And now I know advisors at firms of every shape and size who are getting quality work done around taxes because they took the time to navigate it correctly.

Mando Sallavanti (16:35)
Yeah, and there’s definitely some red tape. Don’t get me wrong. Like I’ve had to get special approval on certain topics. And it’s not even special approval because most advisors that go to leadership and ask for it’s like, hey, yeah, you could do tax planning and you could use these tools. Like Holistiplan is a common one. Like we have to get approval to use it, but it’s, hey, managing partner, I want to use this. Here’s why. What do I need to know? What can’t I do? What could I do next? And like it’s a signature in a day’s review. It’s not like it is, you can’t do this or you need your CPA to do this.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (17:10)
Well Mando, you mentioned LinkedIn and I feel like we need at least spend a little bit of time on that because you’re absolutely crushing it there and that’s how we originally connected actually. At least this is how I remember the story so don’t correct me if I’m wrong because just let me believe this is how it happened. But if I remember correctly, I had looked at your profile because I could see you were really, this is a couple years ago now, you were growing really rapidly, you were posting all over LinkedIn, so I just clicked on your profile to curiosity.

(17:30)
And almost immediately, certainly within a day, I get a message from you that says, hey, I saw you looked at my profile, anything I can do to help you. And I was like, huh, that’s fascinating. And so I took you up on it. We got on a call. And I think you would learn that from someone else. My takeaway from that was you really openly and honestly shared what your approach was because you weren’t worried about people copying it because so what? You were willing to put in the work and be disciplined and be consistent and just work the system that was working for you. And geez, mean, you run circles around me on LinkedIn now, but I mean, from your perspective, like two things I’m really interested in, how has your approach evolved over time and how long did it take before you saw a direct payoff of that work you were putting in?

Mando Sallavanti (18:08)
So let’s go back to when I was in my senior year of college, it’s in the middle of pandemic. I get sent home from school. I’m in my parents’ basement most of my days and back and forth between my college apartment because it was only 25 minutes from my parents’ house. I was reselling sneakers, and I did that on Instagram. if whoever’s, if you could see this on video, there’s sneakers behind me. This is kind of a tribute to my roots, but, I was doing that in Instagram and the way I built, I built a business to, I was doing a hundred pairs a month, which equated to a hundred thousand dollars of revenue in five months as a college kid that like, I didn’t even know I did that much until I gave my CPA all the stuff and I’m like, taxes, what are these things? And anyways, I did it through Instagram, just posting daily, commenting under other people who were potential customers at the time of me or clients, whatever you call them.

(18:59)
And then my content would get seen by more people, because when I would go out and comment, they’d be like, who’s this guy? And then they look at my stuff and they’d be like, this guy has stuff. I want to buy the stuff. And then they buy the stuff and it would rinse and repeat. So when I got into this business, I started how I think 99 % of advisors start. You call friends and family, you ask for referrals, you cold call till your nose bleeds, and you go to networking events and join a B&I group. Like I literally did that. What’s funny is I was good at it and I got in front of the right people and like built a good base for myself. Now, the downfall is I’m like, I can’t do this, and I don’t know how this is gonna be sustainable. So I then had the idea, hey, Instagram worked with sneakers, LinkedIn’s probably better for financial advisor clients. So I started posting on LinkedIn daily. I started finding other creators that I could comment under.

(19:55)
And my thinking was, I’m gonna put myself out there, I’m gonna comment elsewhere, people are gonna come to me when they need me. And it was partially true, but it’s evolved over time to like speaking to the specific clients that I’m trying to get in front of in my posts. So one of the things I love that you mentioned is, hey, you kind of talk about taxes like relatively frequently. The reason I do that is because I kept seeing over and over with higher net worth clients that I work with, taxes are the biggest pain point. So I’m like, if I wanna attract these same people who are my A clients, I should be talking about taxes more. Anyway, dialing in on who am I trying to get in front of? What’s the messaging I’m sending out to them? And then using cues of like, who’s viewed your profile? Who’s interacted with your content? Who’s accepted connection requests is even like a small cue, but a powerful one. Using those to start more conversations in direct messages and other things like that. That’s how I’ve high level built it out and gained a lot of the clients I had.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (20:49)
I appreciate you breaking it down. There’s so many things in there that really are applicable, whether we’re talking about social media or we’re talking about another marketing area or we’re talking about tax planning. At the end of the day, where the value comes from, where the growth comes from is this consistent execution and the willingness to refine as you go along. Whether talking about taxes or marketing, you’re not starting on day one, 100 % confident you’ve got it all figured out. But you are starting on day one committed to taking action.

(21:15)
And then as you take action, as you build that consistency, you’re refining, you’re learning from other people, you’re getting the reps in and getting better yourself. And that’s gotta be the single biggest differentiator, regardless of which area of business we’re talking about, is who’s consistently showing up and humbly willing to learn from other people, from their mistakes, from what works and what doesn’t. And then it takes time for sure, but you’re gonna see the results.

Mando Sallavanti (21:38)
Steven, I had a client who were actually kicking off our relationship Friday. He signed and paid last week with us, got onboarding all that stuff. He said to me, and he reached out to me on LinkedIn, sent me a big long thing we’d met. He said, man, I’ve been trying to do this myself. I’ve been reading your content for over two years now, over two years. So like probably from the beginning that I was posting. He said, I saw your one post about like how you do cashflow management and it kind of integrates into wealth building. And then I tried to like do it myself and then I got really frustrated and I’m like, why am I not just messaging this guy? And he’s like, so I’ve watched you for two and half years. I message you, here we are on the Zoom call. Like just let me know what you charge and I’m in because if I’m gonna get help, it’s gonna be the guy that I’ve read his content every day for two and a half years and know how consistent he is. Cause if he’s consistent there, imagine how consistent he is with me and my family and our planning. And like, that’s exactly what the guy said to me. I’m like, dude, I wish I was recording that. But it’s insane what it can do and what it evolves to.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (22:40)
I love hearing the success stories because at the end of the day, we are trying to build successful businesses here. We’re trying to impact people and the only way you’re going to impact people is by successfully bringing on clients. But that consistency piece is so true. I would love your thoughts on this, but when I create content, whether it’s on the podcast, it’s on LinkedIn, if you were to just kind of stack up all my content on top of each other and then kind of overlap themes, you would only see a handful of themes.

(23:04)
Like even though I have daily posts on LinkedIn, I have weekly podcasts, I speak several times a year, you’re still seeing the same things over and over and over again. And for me, when I first started into this, I was really concerned that I had to talk about different stuff all the time, that I had to constantly be novel and unique and different and special and whatever you wanna call it. And then I realized, kind of like this client of yours is identifying, what I really wanna be is I wanna be seen as an expert in a particular topic so that people associate me with whatever that problem they’re trying to solve is.

Mando Sallavanti (23:31)
Content creation is more about saying the same thing a thousand times than a thousand things one time.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (23:37)
Yeah, well, but it’s no different than serving clients. The advisors I see doing the best work have narrowed down the types of clients they work with. And I know that having a niche gets talked about from a marketing standpoint, but it also completely changes the level of quality you deliver for clients, which makes sense. If you only do one thing all the time, you’re gonna get really good at that one thing. Even if you feel like you’ve said the same thing in every client meeting a thousand times now, the client’s hearing it for the first time, or maybe the second time, because you said it to them last year, but they’re still getting tremendous value out of that. If I remember right, I think you have a sports background, but the same thing comes through in sports, like, right? The greatest athletes with very few exceptions really excel at one sport. Sure, they’re good athletes and can do other things reasonably well, but to be the best at a particular thing, you do that thing over and over and over again.

Mando Sallavanti (24:26)
Yeah, yeah. And think about like from a client standpoint or a prospect standpoint on social media or whatever it is, like we need to be reminded more than we need to be told, right? And I heard that I was at a conference early February here, a friend of mine, Jordan Montgomery speak down in Florida. And he said that I’m like, man, that is like so simple yet so profound. And it just it rings true with everything we do marketing, taxes, financial planning, everything.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (24:51)
Mando, what have you seen be effective in helping kind of coordinate those relationships? You’re out there talking about tax planning, I can’t imagine all of your clients work with Yuri and make it super simple for you. You’re probably managing a lot of different relationships. So what have you seen be effective in facilitating effective communication in that relationship?

Mando Sallavanti (25:08)
So I have multiple accountants, CPAs, tax preparers who aren’t a CPA that I have relationships with that I just know do very good work, very high levels of work. And this has been super valuable because I can match up stylistically, like, hey, this level of complexity client probably doesn’t need the CPA that’s on Yuri’s level doing crazy complex tax planning. When it comes up, but they need a tax preparer and I could kind of give some of the tax strategy around their taxes and when it gets more complex, we’ll kind of get someone else that we need to bring into the table. So knowing stylistically how different accountants work I think is critical. That’s been huge for me with my clients and knowing who to match up with who, seeing how they work. And I’ve been intentional about having those conversations whenever possible.

(25:29)
With accountants who approach me on LinkedIn. And I think it’s natural, like a lot of advisors network with accountants, lot of accountants network with advisors. And I always make time to have those calls because you never know who you’re gonna talk to. It’s like, this is the exact person that I need for that person. And even when I think the perfect fit is for someone, sometimes it’s not. So as far as like, connecting on that front, that’s been a little bit there. Did that answer your question directly though? I feel like I might’ve veered off a little bit.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (26:28)
No, that’s great insight, because that relationship building makes a huge difference. There’s a just dramatic difference between reaching out to an accountant that you’ve built a relationship with and saying, hey, I’m working with these clients, here’s the situation, can we help navigate this together? That’s different than I’m cold reaching out to an accountant I’ve never talked to before on behalf of a client, potentially telling them, about a strategy that they’ve never really put a lot of thought into. The outcome’s going to be very different. I think where I was headed with the question is, maybe a little bit more tactical of, when are you reaching out to these accountants? If you work with a client on a particular strategy during the year, how are you making it easy for that client to make sure that gets reflected correctly at tax time?

Mando Sallavanti (27:04)
Yeah, so like here’s the easiest thing ever. And I think as professionals, we overlook this way too often. We think someone hires us and we have to get as much data as possible and be perfect. And then it’s like this big presentation of like, look at all my advice and how great I am. And it’s like, no, if you have a broken knee, I’m the doctor is gonna come fix the broken knee. Like that’s what we’re doing first. So nine out of 10 business owners that I work with or have worked with. It’s amazing to me who doesn’t have a bookkeeper at a minimum.Like the accountant isn’t always the bookkeeper. Sometimes that’s two separate people. But if they are a business owner and there’s no bookkeeper. I’m like, OK, we haven’t done anything yet, but you need to pay this person like that’s first and foremost. Second, it depends time of year. Usually now if we’re if we have a strategy that we’re coming up with in the wealth building approach or risk mitigation approach where it’s like, hey, this is a tax thing, this is an opportunity for you based on XYZ, here’s what we have, I’m gonna verify this. Typically, once we get to the point that the client wants to implement or explore it, that’s when we’ll introduce an accountant and kind of bring that together.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (28:11)
Mando, I really appreciate all the insight you’re sharing, the experiences, like what you’ve learned over the years. Anything else that comes to mind as you think about the journey you’ve been through and talking to advisors who are looking to level up what they do around taxes?

Mando Sallavanti (28:24)
I think it starts with understanding you don’t need to know everything and it’s okay that your clients know that as well because look, I’m 26, I’m gonna be 27 on tax day funny enough, my birthday is April 15th. And my clients who work with me are super successful people that I appreciate so much. I am a CFP, I’m a certified exit planning advisor, like I have fancy letters and I’ve done the things and have the licenses, blah, blah, blah, blah. But, there are things that experience teaches you that I just don’t know. And I tell them this, this is the first thing I say before someone ever hires me. That is why you need to be able to lean on other professionals and bring people in and humble yourselves that you’re not always going to be the guy or the woman that’s gonna bring the person to the table or bring the advice to the table, but you will bring the person and you will bring the answer. It just might be, I gotta make a phone call. I have to have a conversation. I need to send an email.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (29:16)
That’s a great reminder to end on. Yeah, we don’t, we gotta set clear expectations. We gotta be willing to find the answer. We don’t have to have all the answers off the top of our head. And for, I’m with you. It’s all about getting those reps in, putting the time in, learning as you go. Even if you’re starting simple, that’s why we do things like the 37-point checklist we created on reviewing tax returns. You can go out to retirementtaxservices.com, check that out. That’s why we do things like our tax planning summit, which will be September 30th through October 3rd this year in Phoenix. Again, you can go out to retirementtaxservices.com. Check out the event. We’re super excited about what we’re able to do to help advisors keep leveling up. So Mondo, for everyone listening, mean, you need to go out and follow this guy on LinkedIn. You can find him real easily. He’ll come up real quick. But thanks for being here. Really appreciate everything you’re doing. It’s been great chatting with you.

Mando Sallavanti (30:00)
Steven, thanks so much for having me, man. I really enjoyed the conversation.

Steven Jarvis, CPA (30:03)
Yeah, and to everyone listening, until next time, good luck out there and remember to tip your server, not the IRS.